Eating eggs hurts and kills more animals compared to eating meat

Some just asked by PM where I got the egg figures from. Here's the article: http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/guest-blog/2011/08/11/want-to-kill-fewer-animals-give-up-eggs-not-meat/ Based on the data she uses, her analysis seems right.

According to some animal advocates, it's Meatless Monday. But there is no morally coherent distinction between meat and other animal foods. And if you consume eggs, you are responsible for more animal deaths than if you eat beef or pork. So if you care about animals, go vegan today. And every day.

Quote from: https://www.facebook.com/abolitionistapproach

Stop hurting and exploiting animals. Go vegan!

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As we’ve said above, there is no morally coherent distinction between meat and other animal products. Dairy and eggs also involve suffering and death. In fact, if you stop eating beef and get the same number of calories from eggs, you may actually be responsible for more animal suffering and death given that laying hens are usually killed after one or two laying cycles and all the male chicks born to laying hens are killed immediately. In any event, the meat, dairy , and egg industries are inextricably intertwined. They all necessarily involve suffering; they all necessarily involve death. To stop eating meat but to continue to eat dairy is morally arbitrary and similar to a decision to stop eating meat from spotted cows but to continue to eat meat from brown cows. It makes no sense.

Consumption of any animal products, absent your being stranded on a desert island or adrift on a lifeboat, with no plant foods available, is completely inconsistent with the conventional wisdom we claim to accept. As we discussed above, the good first step is not consuming “happy” animal products or making an arbitrary distinction between meat and other animal products and not eating the former but continuing to eat the latter. The good first step, if you don’t feel able to go vegan immediately, is to do it in stages, starting with breakfast and continuing on.
Francione, Gary; Charlton, Anna (2013-06-24). Eat Like You Care: An Examination of the Morality of Eating Animals (Kindle Locations 1517-1523). Exempla Press. Kindle Edition. 

Vegan reply to 'Vegans avoid the real problems of society - and the much more significant atrocities'

My reply to Kenneth, covering also the issue 'I am not a vegan/strict vegetarian because that human rights are more important than animal rights'

I think that everyone understand the moral difference between uprooting a plant and killing an animal. If we saw someone abusing an animal we would step in and protect the animal, if someone is stepping on, or cutting grass, or cutting down a tree, we don’t believe this is harming any sentient being.

Learn more in this article: http://www.abolitionistapproach.com/a-frequently-asked-question-what-about-plants/#.UciBjJxW6nk
The people who still believe that plants are sentient, can eat of the seeds and the fruits without uprooting any plant.
You will find further reading here: http://www.abolitionistapproach.com/a-frequently-asked-question-what-about-plants/

Eating animals is morally wrong, because it inflicts unnecessary suffering and death upon sentient beings. You already agree with the premise that it is morally wrong to inflict unnecessary suffering and death upon animals. The only reason that you don’t apply this to eating is because of cultural indoctrination.
“You can sit in a coffeehouse and avoid the real problems of society - and the much more significant atrocities that are ongoing”
I do certainly not ignore other problems of our society. Since I became a vegan I have actually become more aware of all the violence and discrimination in our society and I do more to fight against it compared to before.
There is no contradiction between fighting for human rights and fighting for animal rights. You go vegan and you choose not to inflict unnecessary suffering and death upon animals, you substitute your animal products with a vegan diet, etc. It is very easy. You can continue to fight for human rights. A vegan lifestyle is not limiting, and it is a necessity for an ethical lifestyle, and it is our moral obligation to the nonhuman animals.

Furthermore, there is a big interconnection between all the violence and discrimination in our society: The enslavement of animals, the domestication, also has resulted in human slavery, oppression against women, and other forms of oppression that is rampant in our society. It is covered in this book that I want to read: http://cup.columbia.edu/book/978-0-231-15188-7/animal-oppression-and-human-violence#.UZAIageHrdk.facebook

Furthermore, while I believe that it is immoral to consume animal products, I do not judge peoples intentions and their character. For me it took almost 28 years to realize that the necessity and our moral obligation to be a vegan, and that consuming is unethical.

I don’t need a biological degree to understand that it is unethical to inflict unnecessary suffering and death upon animals; and I will certainly not accept justifications such as ‘other animals eats animals and we are at the top of the food chain’, since both those arguments are easily refutable.
Cheers and best wishes
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This is a reply to:
"Anders, aside from photosynthesizing plants and bacteria, all life exists by consuming other life - has this ever occurred to you? A vegan also is extinguishing life in order to survive. I am sure you are a nice fellow but do you even have an operational definition of the word 'moral'? And then once you have that you decide to focus on carnivores and omnivores as entire groups as being 'immoral'? That must feel very good and certainly is convenient! You can sit in a coffeehouse and avoid the real problems of society - and the much more significant atrocities that are ongoing - all the while feeling comfortable in your moral superiority! Hooray for you! While you're sitting there feeling so good, maybe take the time and get a biology degree, which is literally the study of life itself, and see how the chain of life works. Cheers and best wishes."

Eating meat, milk, eggs and other animal products is paying for industrialised animal abuse

For every bite of any animal product, meat, milk, cheese, etc, you are paying for industrialised animal abuse. Please stop exploiting animals. Please start treating them as individuals, and stop treating them as things with no moral value. Please stop exploiting animals.

“If you think that any sentient nonhuman life has a moral value, then it is irrational to deny that all nonhuman life has moral value. To put it another way, if you think that dogs or cats (or whomever) have moral value, you cannot logically exclude cows, fish, pigs, and chickens from the moral community. And having moral value means that we cannot use animals as a resource. Therefore, veganism is what follows from the simple recognition that animals are not things. If animals have any moral value, we cannot use them as resources. Peirod.”
Quote: Gary Francione: https://www.facebook.com/abolitionistapproach

And if you are a vegan, please share with everyone you see is exploiting animals, e.g. by eating animal products. It is our moral responsibility, and if we don't stand up for the animals we are complicit.

 

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There are plenty of starch-based foods without wheat you can cook and eat, e.g. potatoes, rice, oats, lentils, beans, etc.. This is a great health website: http://www.drmcdougall.com/

This is a great vegan website: http://www.vegankit.com/
Please go vegan. For every bite of an animal products, an animal is exploited, hurt, enslaved and killed This is not right. We must eat a harmless diet, and care more of the animals than our taste buds or convenience.
A great article I recommend: http://articles.philly.com/2009-08-14/news/24986151_1_atlanta-falcons-quarterback-vick-illegal-dog-dog-fights

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Thanks Vicky! I went vegan directly when I understood it is wrong to inflict unnecessary suffering and death upon animals. This I did this autumn. So did my wife.

We have a moral obligation towards the animals - not to treat them as resources. We are not allowed to kill them, hurt them and enslave them. ' The journey we should make as vegans, we can’t allow and permit any animal products on our journey. We should do a peaceful journey without oppression and injustice towards the animals, a vegan journey of love and compassion, not a journey that permits some animal exploitation towards the goal of no ‘animal exploitation’.

Please, every time you see an animal product, think of and visualize the animals, their moral value and  think of and visualize the harm and death they have to go through, and then choose not to consume it.

Peace, and take care!

Vegan answer to 'Humans are omnivorous by evolution'/'eating meat is natural'

'Nilan,
“Human are omnivorous by evolution, morality doesn't even come into play here. As a species, criticizing us for consuming meat is as futile as calling bears or crows "immoral" for eating meat.”

No, humans have a choice and can thrive on a vegan diet. We’re eating animal products despite the lack of “necessity”. We are killing and hurting animals despite that we can live and thrive on a vegan diet.
Regardless of whether we have evolved to be able to eat animal products, doesn’t tell whether it is moral or not.
We have evolved to have the capacity to inflict unnecessary violence upon other beings e.g. humans, this doesn’t morally justify unnecessary violence.

Also the statement that we are “omnivores” is flawed. We eat animal products despite having the body of an herbivore.
Humans have evolved to eat meat and paleo-people consumed a lot of meat.

Quite the opposite is true.
Humans have no known anatomical, physiological, or genetic adaptations to meat consumption.
We have many adaptations to plant consumption.
Vitamin C is found in plants. We can’t make it ourselves such as carnivores.
Quote:
http://tedxtalks.ted.com/video/Debunking-the-Paleo-Diet-Christ;search%3Adebunking%20paleo
Some more links here: http://bloganders.blogspot.no/2013/04/vegan-answer-to-humans-are-at-top-of.html

Body odor:

The Effect of Meat Consumption on Body Odor Attractiveness

http://chemse.oxfordjournals.org/content/31/8/747.abstract

True human diet. Humans evolved on a starch-based diet: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0PF5R0ywp4
"Dartmouth Associate Professor of Anthropology, Nathaniel Dominy PhD, talks about his research and why he believes the true human diet is one based in Starch. "

Butter hurts our health, and hurts and kills cows

Hello,
Butter from animals, like all animal products, increases the risk of heart attack:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AYTf0z_zVs0

and causes other health problems: http://www.adelicatebalance.com.au/

Most importantly, it is not right to use, exploit, enslave, hurt and kill  animals for butter, which is done in the milk industry. Cows are forcefully impregnated, their reproductive organs are exploited and their calves are stolen.
Cows, horses, and other animals are consciousness just like we are, and they have the same right as us to live their life without being exploited, enslaved, hurt and killed. They value their lives, family and friends, and we have no right to take this from them.
I recommend this lecture: http://vimeo.com/17538152 and www.vegankit.com
Have a nice day!

How a vegan feels about seeing meat, milk, eggs and other animal products

How a vegan feels about seeing meat, milk, eggs and other animal products:
 I saw a dead chicken on my newsfeed. I was saddened by his death. Not only me, but also his family and friends.
Before his death he was living as a slave, bred up and used, unnecessary exploited, treated as property, a life full of suffering and misery, treated as a commodity. We speak about love, nonviolence and respect; but our plates are filled with unnecessary violence, suffering and exploitation.

Why not look at the situation in the eyes of the victim, the animal that gets abused.
Why not extend our love, compassion and justice to all species.
After all, whether we are consciousness in a human body or in a chicken body or any other body, doesn't change the reality that we are sentient beings with a desire and right to live.

Dog abuse for enjoyment is morally wrong. Unnecessary killing of dogs or
chickens for taste and pleasure is morally no different, since we can get all nutrition through a vegan diet. [More info here: http://www.abolitionistapproach.com/what-michael-vick-taught-us/ ]
See the videos at www.vegankit.com - learn about how the animals are, what they go through and their rights.

Take care! I only want to help everyone on this planet.

Loving an animal and to kill an animal - an oxymoron

I think in order to accomplish world peace we must stop using violence both towards other humans and towards other animals. If we sow violence, we reap violence. If we sow love and compassion, we reap love and compassion.

We should treat others as we want to be treated ourselves
All animals are conscious and they do value life as much as we do. If we love the, we must respect them, respect their relationsships with their family and respect their relationsships with the friends.

We love each other in this forum - I hope. We don't kill each other. Loving and killing are two oxymorons. In order to take someone else's life you need to sacrifice part of your innate love and empathy. This takes place everytime we put another animal on our plate for trivial reasons such as "taste", convenience or habit.

There are no humane ways of killing a human. There are no humane ways of killing another animal.

If we don't want to be killed, we shouldn't kill other animals (regardless of species - humans, dogs, cats, cows, chicken, etc.).
If we don't want someone else to steal our family, we shouldn't steal their family.
If we want to find our purpose in this world, we shouldn't steal others purpose.
If we don't want to be exploited and abused, we shouldn't abuse anyone else.
If we don't want to become enslaved, we shouldn't keep anyone else as a slave.
If we don't want to hurt any animals, we must become vegans (i.e. stop eating, wearing and using animal products, and in other ways do actions that are hurting and killing animals).
If we love animals, we don't kill animals. We don't kill and eat anyone that we love. If we love animals, we must support their want to not be oppressed, including not to be killed.

 I recommend this lecture: http://vimeo.com/17538152

All kind of animal products, including eggs and milk, are causing humans and other animals terrible suffering, oppression, starvation and death. Being vegan is the only way not to participate in the oppression.

If you claim to 'love' animals but you eat animal products, you need to think critically about how you understand love.

http://www.abolitionistapproach.com/a-thought-about-the-meaning-of-love/#.UY6rM404VD8

Vegan answer to 'Humans are at top of the food chain'

Quote: "but i did not fight my wy to the top of the food chain to be a vegan i think its fine if you are"

Humans having the body of an herbivore [see footnote 1], animal products being bad for us [2], and us having not nutritional need at all for animal products [3], claiming that we are at the “top of the Food chain” is an erroneous statement. Just like the gorillas, cows and horses and many other animals we are herbivores. Just like cows, we can eat meat, however it is not good for our body, and not good for us spiritually [4].

We can’t look at other species, and justify our behavior, just because there are predators that hurt and kill other beings. There are many behaviors that some predators do that we would never justify, and if we use this methodology almost any human behavior can be justified. Put a small bunny in the same room as a small child. She will not try to hurt and kill the bunny. Hurting and killing other sentient beings is something that is contradictory to our inner nature, our loving, compassionate and nonviolent nature; and is something that is only learnt by the indoctrination of our culture, which has reduced animals to being commodities. Doing this as a regular habit, we disconnect ourselves to the animals, and we lose some of our capacity to understand that it is wrong to take the life of another being - who is consciousness just like us. Just because they have been given another body than us, doesn't mean that there is any essential difference. This is also discussed in the wonderful book World Peace Diet by Will Tuttle [4]. If you visited a slaughterhouse you would see that the animals don’t want to die and that they suffer tremendously when someone is taking their precious life.

Footnotes:
1.http://michaelbluejay.com/veg/natural.html and http://www.nealhendrickson.com/mcdougall/030700pumeatinthehumandiet.htm [I don't agree With everything in this article, but it contains good facts about human anatomy];
See also this video: Nathaniel Dominy PhD. and the True Human Diet.
 2. http://www.adelicatebalance.com.au/ ;3. http://www.drmcdougall.com/ ; http://www.forksoverknives.com/
4. www.worldpeacediet.org  ; good lecture here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PkQrJZYZN4&NR=1&feature=endscreen

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• Jan Vilse Ah, "nature's food chain". People resign any ability to critically question human actions, and this intellectual and moral passivity -- the attitude of "this is just how things are" -- they try to disguise by presenting it as some kind of pre-assigned natural law or order.
• Sarah K. Woodcock Jan Vilse, humans using nonhumans for food is "nature's food chain" just like whites using blacks for slaves is "nature's slave chain" -- it is right...because it is right. Right?

Eating of animal products causes cancer, heart attacks and coronory disease

We know that consumption of animal products cause cancer and that a plant based diet is treating it:

" Women fear breast cancer above all other health problems. Fortunately, this is a preventable disease with the right diet and a healthy lifestyle. Contrary to what most people hope for, early detection by mammography causes more harm than good. Radical surgery, radiation, and chemotherapy are brutal remedies universally prescribed to women with breast cancer, yet they provide little, if any, survival benefit. Hormone manipulation is of some value. However, the best, and most overlooked, approach for treating breast cancer is the McDougall Program – a plant-food based, low-fat diet with added exercise."
http://www.drmcdougall.com/med_hot_breastcancer.html

A very informative movie: http://www.adelicatebalance.com.au/
The correlation between eating animal products and cancer is backed up in the links I provided, in this: http://www.thechinastudy.com/ ; and more research.
No, everyone doesn't get cancer that eat animal products.

There is also a strong correlation between heart attacks and coronory disease and the consumption of animal products: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EqKNfyUPzoU
And one can get completely out of the risk-zone by eating a healthy vegan diet without processed foods and Oils.

We all agree that it is morally wrong to cause unnecessary suffering and death to animals. Causing animal suffering and death for "taste" is unnecessary

David and everyone else reading,

A cow, or a horse, or a dog, or a cat -- is there any difference? They are all sentient beings, they all have feelings, they all want to live and they all love their family!!!!!
We all agree that it is morally wrong to cause unnecessary suffering and death to animals -- and condemn people who for example enjoy and promote killing innocent dogs just because they got tired of them. However, we must also acknowledge that all animal products-eating is unnecessary and is done merely for "taste" and "enjoyment". So if we want to be moral we must also act upon what we acknowledge -that causing unnecessary suffering and death to animals is unnecessary.
The minimum requirement in order to accomplish this is to go vegan and inspire other people to become vegans.

The eating of a cow or drinking cow milk is directly causing the killing of cows, the splitting of families, parents losing their children and children losing the parents, immense suffering and death. All animal products are causing suffering to and killing animals.

I really recommend this lecture: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvZpF1R6GUo

The solution is to care of the animals we have, give them the best life we can get (since they can't survive in the wild because of our breeding) - including not killing them; and then to completely stop all domestication and breeding and the terrible suffering they are causing many animals.

Cancer breaking out in the body is caused by eating animal products. The cure is that we stop eating animal products and we will eliminate cancer from this earth:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DId_xJxbemQ
http://www.drmcdougall.com/