Visar inlägg med etikett Counter arguments to veganism. Visa alla inlägg
Visar inlägg med etikett Counter arguments to veganism. Visa alla inlägg

lördag 10 augusti 2013

Factory farming? Moral problem with all animal agriculture.

A huge amount of time and energy is spent campaigning to end 'factory farming' in its various forms. The problem is that the current demand for animal products is such that more 'humane' farming methods will never be sufficient to supply anything but a small portion of that demand. The economic importance of animal agriculture will always impede attempts to simply 'shut down' factory farms in favour of alternatives and attempts to do so without addressing the matter of consumption are likely to prove futile.

So let's cut out the 'middle man' and concentrate resources on vegan education. That way we both reduce demand for animal products as food and influence all the other ways in which animals are exploited.

lördag 3 augusti 2013

You can't both respect animals and kill animals for food

But if we don't have any need for animal foods, how can we say that we are respecting animals when we are disrespecting their life and killing them for palate "pleasure"/convenience?

We all agree that “unnecessary” animal suffering and death are morally wrong. If that means anything at all, it must mean that we cannot justify animal suffering and death by reasons of pleasure or convenience. But what is our best justification for imposing suffering and death on the 56 billion animals (excluding fish) we eat annually?

Pleasure. Convenience.

So the only justification we have is that which we agree cannot suffice. This is moral schizophrenia.
If you are not a vegan, you are participating directly in animal exploitation. Being a vegan is easy, better for your health, and the most powerful way that you, as an individual, can say “no” to animal exploitation.

I recommend: http://www.eatlikeyoucarebook.com/

fredag 2 augusti 2013

Vegan reply to counter argument: But…Isn’t eating animal products, meat, milk, eggs, etc., natural?

 If our body was designed for meat consumption, humans wouldn't get these problems: http://vimeo.com/15787322 , http://www.adelicatebalance.com.au/
Meat in large quantities is not dangerous for an omnivore.

I don't understand this "human nature"/natural-argument.

It is also discussed here:
Question 5: Isn’t human use of animals a “tradition,” or “natural,” and therefore morally justified?Answer: Every form of discrimination in the history of humankind has been defended as “traditional.” Sexism is routinely justified on the ground that it is traditional for women to be subservient to men: “A woman’s place is in the home.” Human slavery has been a tradition in most cultures at some times. The fact that some behavior can be described as traditional has nothing to do with whether the behavior is or is not morally acceptable.

In addition to relying on tradition, some characterize our use of animals as “natural” and then declare it to be morally acceptable. Again, to describe something as natural does not in itself say anything about the morality of the practice. In the first place, just about every form of discrimination ever practiced has been described as natural as well as traditional. The two notions are often used interchangeably. We have justified human slavery as representing a natural hierarchy of slave owners and slaves. We have justified sexism as representing the natural superiority of men over women. Moreover, it is a bit strange to describe our modern commodification of animals as natural in any sense of the word. We have created completely unnatural environments and agricultural procedures in order to maximize profits. We do bizarre experiments in which we transplant genes and organs from animals into humans and vice versa. We are now cloning animals. None of this can be described as natural. Labels such as “natural” and “traditional” are just that: labels. They are not reasons. If people defend the imposition of pain and suffering on an animal based on what is natural or traditional, it usually means that they cannot otherwise justify their conduct.
Quote: www.abolitionistapproach.com/faqs/

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There is no doubt that we can live a very healhty life on a vegan diet:
“It is the position of the American Dietetic Association that appropriately planned vegetarian diets, including total vegetarian or vegan diets, are healthful, nutritionally adequate, and may provide health benefits in the prevention and treatment of certain diseases. Well-planned vegetarian diets are appropriate for individuals during all stages of the life cycle, including pregnancy, lactation, infancy, childhood, and adolescence, and for athletes.” — Academy of Nutrition and Dietetics (formerly the American Dietetic Association)

Thus, eating animal foods is inflicting unnecessary harm and death upon animals, and this we all agree is morally wrong.


---------------------More arguments:

Quote from www.eatlikeyoucarebook.com/ :
This “But” is like saying that God wants us to eat animals but we don’t need to bother with God.  Something else that is big and important—nature— wants us to eat animals. If we don’t eat animals,we are acting against nature. We are behaving in
an unnatural way. That’s powerful stuff—even if you’re an atheist. In fact, “But Natural” is like “But God” without God. It seeks to establish necessity, but without God. But why do we think that nature intends, whatever that means, that we eat animals? The usual response is to say that we are physically adapted to eat meat and other animal products.
 
Putting aside that many people are lactose intolerant, and that many physicians are pointing out that animal products are detrimental to human health, the most we can say is that we can eat animal products; there is nothing about our bodies that suggests that our bodies are designed to do so. Humans compare physically much more to herbivores than to carnivores. Carnivores have well-developed claws. We don’t have claws. We also lack the sharp front teeth carnivorous animals need. Although we still have canine teeth, they are not sharp and cannot be used in the way carnivorous animals use their sharp canine teeth. We have flat molar teeth, as seen in herbivores, such as sheep, that we use for grinding. Carnivores have a short intestinal tract so that they can quickly expel decaying meat. Herbivores have a much longer intestinal tract as do humans. Herbivores and humans have weak stomach acid relative to carnivores who have strong hydrochloric acid in their stomachs to digest meat. Herbivorous animals have well-developed salivary glands for pre-digesting fruits and grains and have alkaline saliva that is needed to predigest grains, as do humans. Carnivorous animals do not have similar salivary glands and have acid saliva.

(..) And, as we stated earlier, the evidence is quite clear that we don’t need animal products to be optimally healthy. You would think that if we were intended to eat animal products, those of us who don’t (and haven’t for decades) would suffer deleterious health effects. But we don’t. We do just fine. We have to make sure we get vitamin B-12, which humans do not manufacture, or at least not in reliable quantities. But all humans have to get B-12 from somewhere. Carnivores get it from meat; vegans get it from nutritional yeast, other fortified food, or supplements. But all B-12 comes from microorganisms. (..)
 
So while there is considerable evidence that animal foods are detrimental to human health, we don’t want to get into a battle of studies here to convince you that it’s healthier not to eat animal products. We do, however, want to make clear that the very best a consumer of animal products can say is that her diet is no better than that of someone who eats a balanced diet of non-animal foods.
 
In sum, there is no evidence that nature requires that we eat animal products. Indeed, the extant evidence is to the contrary." End of quote.
 
More Resources:
Humans have no known anatomical, physiological, or genetic adaptations to meat consumption.
We have many adaptations to plant consumption.
Vitamin C is found in plants. We can’t make it ourselves such as carnivores.
Quote:
http://tedxtalks.ted.com/video/Debunking-the-Paleo-Diet-Christ;search%3Adebunking%20paleo

True human diet. Humans evolved on a starch-based diet: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0PF5R0ywp4
"Dartmouth Associate Professor of Anthropology, Nathaniel Dominy PhD, talks about his research and why he believes the true human diet is one based in Starch. "

Some more links here: http://bloganders.blogspot.no/2013/04/vegan-answer-to-humans-are-at-top-of.html

måndag 8 juli 2013

Vegan reply to 'Morality is a matter of opinion'

“Morality is a matter of opinion”

You are claiming that morals are subjective, just like some may prefer tomatoes over cucumber.

Basically you are saying that:
“It isn’t morally wrong to murder. Rape isn’t morally wrong. Animal abuse isn’t morally wrong. Racism isn’t morally wrong. Nazism isn’t morally wrong. Sexism isn’t morally wrong. Heterosexism isn’t morally wrong. Other kinds of abuse, violence and discrimination aren’t morally wrong.”

You are saying that some prefer to murder other people and some prefer not to murder other people, but this preference is as relevant as is whether someone prefers tomatoes over cucumber.
You are saying that some prefer to be violent and discriminate based on irrelevant criteria, and some people prefer to show love, empathy, nonviolence and compassion; but you are saying that this fundamental difference is just a matter of opinion, e.g. some people prefer bananas over apples, or football over hockey.

I think this notion is completely mistaken and inherently immoral.
Basically, since you say that all of these issues are just a matter of opinion, you are also encouraging that it is okay to stand silent when people are being oppressed by people who adhere to sexism, racism, nazism, heterosexism, etcetera. Standing silent is being complicit with moral transgressions, discrimination and violence.

Our moral intuition says that it is morally wrong to cause other individuals unnecessary suffering and death – both humans and nonhumans. I strongly believe we should follow our moral intuition which leads to more love, compassion, empathy and nonviolence, instead of the theoretical construct and opinion that “moral is a matter of opinion” which only leads to more suffering, harm, violence and apathy in this world.

I recommend this article about moral realism: http://www.abolitionistapproach.com/new-atheism-and-animal-ethics-some-reflections/
If we follow our moral intuition, and reason clearly about our moral obligations based on this, it leads us to fight against all violence and discrimination, including speciecism: http://www.abolitionistapproach.com/human-and-nonhuman-rights-as-inextricably-intertwined-in-a-nutshell/#.UdrhcG1RfO4
And thus if we embrace our moral intuition that it is morally wrong to inflict animals unnecessary suffering and death, we will embrace veganism and go vegan. You will find further reading about this here: http://www.facebook.com/abolitionistapproach

fredag 5 juli 2013

Vegan/strict vegetarian reply to 'Doesn't God want us to eat animals'

Vegans are claiming it is wrong to inflict unnecssary suffering and death, and thus we can't justify consuming animals, since we can live and thrive on a vegan diet.

"Even if you believe that you have a soul and animals don’t, and that we ought to prefer the interests of a human in any situation in which we must choose— that is, in any situation of legitimate conflict— that gets us right back to the fact that when you are deciding what to eat tonight , there is no conflict. There is only a choice. If you choose the animal product, you are participating in suffering and death in the absence of any sort of conflict or compulsion. Your only justification is that you enjoy consuming animal products or that it is more convenient for you to do so.

Think about it this way. Imagine that Michael Vick were to say that dog fighting was okay because dogs don’t have souls. Would you buy that? Imagine that Vick says God wants us to fight dogs because they don’t have souls. Would you buy that? You would respond to Vick that God’s creating us in God’s image means that in situations of conflict between human and nonhumans, we ought to protect the human interest over the animal interest. So in the situation in which a person is in a true emergency situation , such as being in a situation where she is starving to death with no plant foods to eat, it would make sense for a religious person to say that God wants her to kill and eat an animal and that she ought to do so. But saying that God wants us to eat animal foods when we are not in that sort of emergency situation is no different from saying that God wants us to fight dogs. If you would find the latter to be objectionable—outrageous perhaps— you should find the former so as well.

Francione, Gary; Charlton, Anna (2013-06-24). Eat Like You Care: An Examination of the Morality of Eating Animals (Kindle Locations 569-570). Exempla Press. Kindle Edition.
Quote: http://www.eatlikeyoucarebook.com/

There is no ethical justification at all of taking the life of a sentient being: http://articles.philly.com/2009-08-14/news/24986151_1_atlanta-falcons-quarterback-vick-illegal-dog-dog-fights