Andy,
Animals are conscious and have a soul.
These are the claims of science: http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg21528836.200-animals-are-conscious-and-should-be-treated-as-such.html ; and also the claims of millions of people being in touch with animals whom understand that the connection and relation they have with them is not the connection/relation with a non-conscious 'fur-robot'. Without any soul that is exactly what the animals would be.
Man and animals didn't miraculously pop up on earth. What you observe here today is the result of billion individual’s decision throughout hundreds of millions of years (and the resulting evolution of certain instincts, etc., based on choices made by animals); and it is not logical to blame the Creator of choices that His creations have made. The Creator created the universe, but didn’t control everything that occurred afterwards. Animals have a choice of what actions to make.
I don’t believe that the Creator sees any satisfaction or joy at all when a fox kills a rabbit; causing fear, suffering and death to the rabbit; and suffering to her family and potential human companions. I don’t think He approves of it.
You wrote: “As for empathy and cruelty, don't get me wrong, it is important for man to treat animals humanely, and in all honesty, we don't always do so.”
Good that you state so!!!!!
However, your meat eating states the opposite. You are preaching by your actions.
There is no secret that anyone’s meat eating is causing severe pain and suffering for animals: See e.g. this documentation: http://www.peta.org/issues/animals-used-for-food/factory-farming.aspx
Your lifestyle gives your silent approval of this.
You state: “Animals are not described as being created in God's image.”
And this is according to a book, which is written by human animals, and based on their misunderstanding.
Yet many animals are showing far more love and compassion to their fellow beings and humans compared to men themselves.
I believe that sentient beings all have attributes that resemble the nature of our Creator. However, most sentient beings are not showing love and compassion to all animals and are thus not living according to the image of our Creator.
I haven’t found any evidence that humans are ‘ABOVE’ animals. Surely man has attributes and brain capacities that other animals don’t have. However, a less complex brain/brain not using all of its potential functions in a human or another animal doesn’t make an individual of any less worth.
måndag 26 november 2012
Spirituality, animals vs humans, empathy, Gary Yourofsky
Plant-eating-animals are on a higher spiritual understanding than those human animals whom participate in killing sentient human or non-human animals.
Taking another innocent sentient being's life is certainly the worst atrocity you can commit!
Just because writers of religious books, including the Torah, wrote that it is okay, does NOT make it ethical.
Causing sentient beings suffering and death doesn't reflect a loving and compassionate Creator.
There exists no proof whatsoever that the value/worth of a non-human animal, would be any less than the value of a human animal.
”I want to ask you, to use some empathy right now. And when I say ‘empathy’, what I’m saying is: place yourself in the position of the animals, and start to view this issue from the animals’ point of view. From the victims’ point of view. When you examine any form of injustice, whether humans are victims or animals are victims, please remember the victim’s point of view. If you are not the victim, don’t examine it entirely from your point of view because when YOU’RE NOT the victim, it becomes pretty easy to rationalize and excuse cruelty, injustice, inequality, slavery, and even murder. But when you’re the victim, things look a lot differently from that angle.” - Gary Yourofsky
Taking another innocent sentient being's life is certainly the worst atrocity you can commit!
Just because writers of religious books, including the Torah, wrote that it is okay, does NOT make it ethical.
Causing sentient beings suffering and death doesn't reflect a loving and compassionate Creator.
There exists no proof whatsoever that the value/worth of a non-human animal, would be any less than the value of a human animal.
”I want to ask you, to use some empathy right now. And when I say ‘empathy’, what I’m saying is: place yourself in the position of the animals, and start to view this issue from the animals’ point of view. From the victims’ point of view. When you examine any form of injustice, whether humans are victims or animals are victims, please remember the victim’s point of view. If you are not the victim, don’t examine it entirely from your point of view because when YOU’RE NOT the victim, it becomes pretty easy to rationalize and excuse cruelty, injustice, inequality, slavery, and even murder. But when you’re the victim, things look a lot differently from that angle.” - Gary Yourofsky
söndag 25 november 2012
Vegan, ethical lifestyle; 'organic meat' a myth
Brian,
You wrote: "Not all meat is poor quality product produced in industrial plants, there is another choice - to eat organic "
First of all, It is always unethical to take the life of another sentient being. It also causes them and their famlily suffering. Who gave man the right to take the life of any sentient and feeling being?
Secondly,
Why their may be a few farmers whom treat their animals well for a few year, before their horrendous slaughter of their companions;
the term 'organic meat' is usually a myth: http://www.peta.org/issues/Animals-Used-For-Food/Free-Range-Organic-Meat-Eggs-Dairy.aspx
Lastly I would like to recommend everyone this video with many convincing and ethical arguments of why to live a vegan lifestyle:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQCe4qEexjc&feature=plcp
You wrote: "Not all meat is poor quality product produced in industrial plants, there is another choice - to eat organic "
First of all, It is always unethical to take the life of another sentient being. It also causes them and their famlily suffering. Who gave man the right to take the life of any sentient and feeling being?
Secondly,
Why their may be a few farmers whom treat their animals well for a few year, before their horrendous slaughter of their companions;
the term 'organic meat' is usually a myth: http://www.peta.org/issues/Animals-Used-For-Food/Free-Range-Organic-Meat-Eggs-Dairy.aspx
Lastly I would like to recommend everyone this video with many convincing and ethical arguments of why to live a vegan lifestyle:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQCe4qEexjc&feature=plcp
Vegan life style; don't eat animal products
For me it was an easy shift. It is impossible for me to eat animal
products (including eggs, milk and honey), since I don't want to partake
in sentient beings death and suffering. And everyone eating animal
products is contributing to this.
Animals are just treated terribly; some examples: http://www.peta.org/search/SearchResults.aspx?q=factory%20farm [also in Sweden they are, e.g. chickens: http://www.djurskyddet.se/se/vart-arbete/tips--rad-om-djur/konsumera-ratt/livsmedel/kyckling ]
People whom have eating meat can have a lot of meat cravings, since regular meat-eating in several ways is like a drug; but with a strong motivation one can overcome it.
I also recommend you this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQCe4qEexjc
I found this website helpful (ignoring that which contains animal products): www.drfuhrman.com/
There are plenty of very tasty vegan food to make.
Why do you find it difficult?
Have a great day my friend !! Take care!!
Animals are just treated terribly; some examples: http://www.peta.org/search/SearchResults.aspx?q=factory%20farm [also in Sweden they are, e.g. chickens: http://www.djurskyddet.se/se/vart-arbete/tips--rad-om-djur/konsumera-ratt/livsmedel/kyckling ]
People whom have eating meat can have a lot of meat cravings, since regular meat-eating in several ways is like a drug; but with a strong motivation one can overcome it.
I also recommend you this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQCe4qEexjc
I found this website helpful (ignoring that which contains animal products): www.drfuhrman.com/
There are plenty of very tasty vegan food to make.
Why do you find it difficult?
Have a great day my friend !! Take care!!
måndag 19 november 2012
Bibeln, djur , vegetarian, vegan
Hej Aram,
Här följer en del som jag håller för sant nu (bl.a. om djur):
Jag argumentar att vi inte ska äta någon individ som har ett medvetande, inklusive kan uppleva smärta och andra känslor.
Plantor har inget medvetande – och det är ingen individ som vi orsakar skada genom att äta plantor. Jag hävdar att vi har rätt att på ett etiskt sätt använda oss av det som endast är materia utan medvetande, t.ex. plantor, vatten och bakterier.
Fiskar, kor, hästar och många andra djur har ett medvetande. Även många insekter kan ha ett medvetande: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1228661/Insects-consciousness-able-count-claim-experts.html
Varför ska vi orsaka andra medvetande individer smärta? Vad ger oss den rättigheten?
Vi kan så enkelt undvika det eftersom det inte är några svårigheter att leva på en vegansk diet.
Varför jag menar att man inte ska äta någon individ med ett medvetande: Jag tror det finns en Skapare och det påverkar min etik i hur jag ser på en individs liv och vårt förhållningssätt till alla individer. Jag tror inte längre på någon religiös bok (efter 11 år som en religiös fundamentalist- inget som jag är stolt över) eftersom jag har funnit fel, motsägelser och oetiska bud. Jag hävdar att Skaparen har gett individer en själ – en icke-fysisk komponent som ger individer t.ex. möjlighet att ha en fri vilja (och som gör oss till mer en oerhört sofistikerat robot, som inte har ett medvetande eller fri vilja). Vidare menar jag att vi inte har fått någon rätt att ta det liv som Skaparen har gett till individer.
De flesta människor förstår att det är objektivt fel att ta en oskyldig människas liv. Jag gör inte någon skillnad på arten av denna individ; och tycker inte att en mer avancerad hjärna och t.ex. en mer avancerad förmåga att resonera ger oss en rättighet att ta andra individers liv och att orsaka andra individer smärta och lidande. Jag menar istället att ökad kunskap och vårt stora medvetande att vi kan leva en livsstil utan att ta andra individers liv (oavsett art) ger oss ett större ansvar i fråga om hur vi lever.
.... [Slut citat]
Vad tycker du?
Jag har sett två grisfarmar här i Rakkestad. Igår såg jag grisar på en yta på 6 m^2 med 8 grisar. Det är helt oacceptabelt att blanda djur så. Grisar trivs som bäst när dem får springa runt på gräs och leka. De tycker om livet när folk behandlar dem bra!
Jag menar att Bibelns författar hade fel när dem trodde att Skaparen gav dem tillåtelse att offra och döda djur.
Se mer här om hur mycket kor, grisar och får älskar liv och hur illa folk behandlar dem: http://www.youtube.com/user/gentlebarn
Ha det bra!
mvh Anders
Här följer en del som jag håller för sant nu (bl.a. om djur):
Jag argumentar att vi inte ska äta någon individ som har ett medvetande, inklusive kan uppleva smärta och andra känslor.
Plantor har inget medvetande – och det är ingen individ som vi orsakar skada genom att äta plantor. Jag hävdar att vi har rätt att på ett etiskt sätt använda oss av det som endast är materia utan medvetande, t.ex. plantor, vatten och bakterier.
Fiskar, kor, hästar och många andra djur har ett medvetande. Även många insekter kan ha ett medvetande: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1228661/Insects-consciousness-able-count-claim-experts.html
Varför ska vi orsaka andra medvetande individer smärta? Vad ger oss den rättigheten?
Vi kan så enkelt undvika det eftersom det inte är några svårigheter att leva på en vegansk diet.
Varför jag menar att man inte ska äta någon individ med ett medvetande: Jag tror det finns en Skapare och det påverkar min etik i hur jag ser på en individs liv och vårt förhållningssätt till alla individer. Jag tror inte längre på någon religiös bok (efter 11 år som en religiös fundamentalist- inget som jag är stolt över) eftersom jag har funnit fel, motsägelser och oetiska bud. Jag hävdar att Skaparen har gett individer en själ – en icke-fysisk komponent som ger individer t.ex. möjlighet att ha en fri vilja (och som gör oss till mer en oerhört sofistikerat robot, som inte har ett medvetande eller fri vilja). Vidare menar jag att vi inte har fått någon rätt att ta det liv som Skaparen har gett till individer.
De flesta människor förstår att det är objektivt fel att ta en oskyldig människas liv. Jag gör inte någon skillnad på arten av denna individ; och tycker inte att en mer avancerad hjärna och t.ex. en mer avancerad förmåga att resonera ger oss en rättighet att ta andra individers liv och att orsaka andra individer smärta och lidande. Jag menar istället att ökad kunskap och vårt stora medvetande att vi kan leva en livsstil utan att ta andra individers liv (oavsett art) ger oss ett större ansvar i fråga om hur vi lever.
.... [Slut citat]
Vad tycker du?
Jag har sett två grisfarmar här i Rakkestad. Igår såg jag grisar på en yta på 6 m^2 med 8 grisar. Det är helt oacceptabelt att blanda djur så. Grisar trivs som bäst när dem får springa runt på gräs och leka. De tycker om livet när folk behandlar dem bra!
Jag menar att Bibelns författar hade fel när dem trodde att Skaparen gav dem tillåtelse att offra och döda djur.
Se mer här om hur mycket kor, grisar och får älskar liv och hur illa folk behandlar dem: http://www.youtube.com/user/gentlebarn
Ha det bra!
mvh Anders
Bees, honey and being vegan
Hello Paul,
I hope you are doing well!
Regarding honey: In the bee-industry they many time kill the queens; and bees get hurt when they take away THEIR honey.
You agree that we shouldn't hurt conscious beings.
Bees are conscious and actually can feel the pain.
I found this today: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1228661/Insects-consciousness-able-count-claim-experts.html
I have stopped eating honey.
lördag 17 november 2012
Religious people, truth, Torah? Use your compassion, love and intellect to be a good person
Andrew,
If you follow a religious book you are blindly following other people's eyes and heart - i.e. their understanding/claimed understanding. This is quite disastrous for millions of innocent animals and people suffering and getting killed throughout millennium. So why, o why, are you assuming Torah to be true?????
You are accusing me and other people claiming that we are not allowed to take the life of the Creator's sentient beings, of serving myself rather than the Creator --- but where is your evidence for this accusation??
I rather use and develop my compassion and love, intellect and logic - attributes which the Creator bestowed in us (without using all of my abilities given to me by the Creator) - then blindly follow a book with contradictions, errors and immoral killings and other immoral practices .
If you follow a religious book you are blindly following other people's eyes and heart - i.e. their understanding/claimed understanding. This is quite disastrous for millions of innocent animals and people suffering and getting killed throughout millennium. So why, o why, are you assuming Torah to be true?????
You are accusing me and other people claiming that we are not allowed to take the life of the Creator's sentient beings, of serving myself rather than the Creator --- but where is your evidence for this accusation??
I rather use and develop my compassion and love, intellect and logic - attributes which the Creator bestowed in us (without using all of my abilities given to me by the Creator) - then blindly follow a book with contradictions, errors and immoral killings and other immoral practices .
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